11 Comments

1. Hany says:

   February 3, 2012 at 13:09

   the Awlad Sulayman is the most important tribe in the Sirte and Fezzan so as AL-Jofrra since 800 years until now
2. libyan says:

   February 3, 2012 at 13:06

   Tribal factor is so important in libya , As a researcher I can say that , some people trying say wrong things about the real powers in libyan citeis because they want the world thinking about libya as they want those like Mouslmes brotherhood and other false parties ,the real role has been always in tribes every were in libya , so many people in Cyrenica and Fezzan want federal system to be back to libya
3. Sandra says:

   August 27, 2011 at 10:23

   If you do some more research, I think you’ll find that the tribal barriers in Libya have been greatly eroded by 1- migration to the cities 2- a youth culture that is forward thinking and inclusive. The tribal factor is not insignificant, but not as significant as some would have outsiders believe. The tension between the Berbers (Tamazight) and Arabs is of concern and is addressed in the Draft Constitution which guarantees cultural and linguistic freedom in Libya.
   Interesting from an historical standpoint is that Libya has been divided between East and West since about 600 bc when the Greeks colonized Cyrene. The east was under Carthage, then Rome, then the Vandals. Even under the Roman empire, Cyrenaica was Greco, speaking Greek and continuing Greek customs, while Leptis, Sabratha etc (Tripolitania) spoke Latin and were definitely Roman.
   But that was a long time ago. Gaddafi fueled the differences between Libyans East and West and played the tribes off against each other. A new Libya will work to consolidate the people into one identity. The war has done much to do that among the youth already.
4. ALIALI says:

   March 24, 2011 at 03:38

   THERE IS ALSO TRIBE IS CALLED ALTUBO IN SOUTH LIBYA, THY LIVE IN SABHA, KOFRA, AND GATROON.
5. Jesper says:

   March 3, 2011 at 16:01

   Great work Sandra! Finally a place where you can see the tribal who is who in Libya laid out logically so you can find stuff.

   As an engineer I might just make it into a spreadsheet. All the work has been done already.
6. Len Carpenter says:

   February 27, 2011 at 14:00

   My article yesterday was a bit behind the times. I hadn’t heard of Obama’s forthright statement calling for Gaddafi to leave Libya. As with Mubarak, Gaddafi has overstepped the bounds by unleashing civil violence against essentially peaceful protests. He may not have emptied the jails yet, but the reports of giving trios of “loyal” civilians guns and SUVs and a lieutenant, to spread terror and repression in the streets of Tripoli is unforgivable. This is reminiscent of Papa Doc Duvalier’s “technicals” machine-gunning voter lines in Haiti. As Obama said, this shows that Gaddafy has lost the ability to govern and should step down. In Libya, his tactics may be a dangerous appeal to tribe loyalties, but hopefully tribal confict can be avoided under the banners of open government and democratic equality.
7. Len Carpenter says:

   February 26, 2011 at 18:12

   First let me say that I’m profoundly ignorant about Libya except for the street rumors in the 60′s and 80′s. If I say anything that seems too radical or conservative, don’t hesitate to set me straight. I’m receptive sometimes.

   I spent time looking at your site and listening to speeches. I see that Gaddafi’s son Saif has just offered negotiations with the Libyan demonstrators.

   It seems clear that Gaddafi is demented… Unless he wants to seem crazy, so that he can bow out and let his son(s) take over as a semi-concession to the (what do we call them, demonstrators, rebels, reformers?) Anyway, he seems too far gone even to be pretending.

   Saif, on the other hand, sounds formidable, with his degree in democracy-building (which is now likely to be taken back by his alma maters.)

   The Gaddafi Band of Brothers looks pretty influential. Covering all the bases, they’re more imposing than Uday and Kusay. The daughter is a heavy hitter too, defending Iraqis against Bush.

   In the part of the speech I heard, Saif seems to say or hint at some factors that might be relevant, especially to Moslem Middle-Easterners.

   1. Libya has oil that other countries want.

   2. Libya may not have the basis for a prosperous or even viable urban economy without the oil dollars/Euros. They don’t even have a Nile, just the Qatar Depression, and no great pyramids for tourism.

   3. Presumably Muammar has manage to nationalize a part of the oil revenue, but either the reformers feel it’s not a big enough share, or else they think he’s keeping too much of it for his family and cronies. (If his wife’s a shopaholic, that may hurt their image.)

   4. Over the years Muammar has been a stable enough custodian of the oil to win European acceptance and US trade status, even after the plane bombing. Can anyone else cut as good a deal for his country with the oil barons?

   5. Europe, half an hour away, isn’t likely to tolerate much instability in an oil source as big as the Gulf of Mexico. If “Western” leaders receive political pressure, most of it is likely to be over oil prices.

   6. This makes the Gaddafis’ ruthless drive for status-quo stability seem credible. The oil masters may be waiting to see whether he can keep things steady — or they may be preparing to move in and install a more tractable puppet who’ll sell out the oil cheaper. (In Latin America this class is called Vendepatrias, those who sell their country.)

   7. Quite likely the Gaddafis brought in the mercenaries as a pretext for violent military repression, and now it’s not about blogs and cellphones, but about tanks and military unit loyalty.

   8. If Saif can retain the pose (or posture?) of a democratic reform expert cum hard-headed realist, they might be able to negotiate a transition to a more open government, and maybe even get better terms with the foreign oil companies. I seem to recall that Muammar started out as a radical/nationalist revolutionary with at least a socialist cachet. But he may have turned tyrant (a la Saddam Hussein) to suppress (not religious, but) tribal rivalries and ambitions.

   But all this is based on Saif’s rhetoric. Too bad the speech translators are so poor at their jobs, or so scared. It would help me if I knew what the goals of the reformers in the street are… if they know, other than to oust Gaddafi.

   In my mind the threat of invasion from a neighboring land or by sea, seems credible. Saif mentions the Bosnian air war, a horrible event for the people on the ground. Hard to tell now whether it was about ethnic cleansing crimes or economic subjugation. Once upon a time we had Yugo automobiles, now we don’t.

   I would do anything to spare the Libyans the agony of Iraq, taking down a stable entrenched dictator of a functioning socialist state for the benefit of Big Oil. Of course, that was a huge American D-Day, no expense spared, initiated by Shock and Awe and resulting in the total dismantling and subjugation of the Iraqi nation to corporate interests. Libya is all coastal and would fall faster. But with multiple tribes vying, there could be chaos, like Mogadishu. (Or a return to the Tripoli pirates, along with Somali ones?) If the US and UK go in there with Depleted Uranium weaponry, the whole country could be rendered uninhabitable (that is, unless you like severe cancer risk) for untold thousands of years.

   According to investigative journalist Greg Palast (as I understand his book Armed Madhouse) our reason for invading Iraq was to help Bush’s friends the Arab Oil Cartel and allow them to set monoply oil prices, which had been continually undercut by price drops from Saddam Hussein. Our presence in Afghanistan is allegedly to protect an oil pipeline, to keep all of the Caspian Basin oil from flowing just to Russia and China.

   My insight on all this comes from the computer real-time-strategy game, Tiberian Sun. There, you need the energy-rich Tiberium crystals that sprout up from the ground. Like oil, Tiberium is limited. Even if you didn’t need more energy to build your own army bases and vehicles, you’d still need to go harvest (or destroy) the crystals just to keep your opponents from building up their armies and attacking you.

   See, even if we go green overnight, they’ll still have this incredible fossil energy source all the cheaper to outproduce and outmilitarize us. I think this is the root of our geopolitical strategy in this “Fossil Age.”

   What it will take is effective, enforceable worldwide controls on carbon pollution to keep any country from getting ahead of the game. Maybe that way some oil can be saved for future centuries.

   Of course, Bush and his puppet masters Cheney and GHW Bush are all Texas oilmen and hand-holding friends of the Saudi oil family, so the whole epoch from 1980 to 2008 was all about oil barons — call them Oleogarchs. Since then, it seems that Wall Street speculators and Bank Robbers (i.e., Banksters) have had more to do with raising and dropping the price of oil. The Saudis just charge what the traffic will bear, but the hedge fund thieves create and pop Oil Bubbles for profit.

   So I hope for diplomacy, compromise, unity in Libya. The main world focus will be on Egypt, and Libya could be neglected and quietly slipped into British Petroleum’s hip pocket.

Leave a Reply

Click here to cancel reply.

Name (required)

Mail (will not be published) (required)

Website

CAPTCHA Code *